Very interesting and more than one answer depending on where you are observing. Been following you as you are an interesting view on the ways things are playing out 🙏
If you look at life from a " spiritual " perspective then everything is perfect exactly as it is. From the smallest particle to the largest child labour colbolt mine for must have tech.
If you look at life through the lens of being a separate individual full of desire, personal goals and ambition then the concept of growth and development is important.
If you try to mix the two, you get gobbledygook and mental indigestion.
It's probably healthy to split the two clearly.
Spirituality is the awakening from the illusion of being a separate, unique, and special individual who lives on a special unique planet. This is our only problem, the delusional belief that we are separate individuals.
Money is not a problem, climate change is not a problem, war is not a problem, family history is not a problem, race is not a problem, gender is not a problem, corrupt politicians are not a problem...and so on.
The only problem is the belief we are something we are not.
Everything is perfect - now, everything is working towards awakening from the dream of separation - now.
The one things a separate self hates to hear is that it needs do nothing.
Right where you are reading this, right now, is it.
Complete disinterest in the future, complete disinterest in the past.
Events will arise, plans will unfold, but always here in the present moment, momenting.
This practical insight may be of use to business people and spiritual seekers alike.
The mind only has three thoughts, which it runs at lightening speed so that it appears as one thought.
1st Thought. Measurement. The mind is always measuring things.
"how old is she"
"how much money does he earn"
"what time is it"
"how much"
"how far is it to the moon"
2nd Thought. Comparison. After measuring things, the mind compares things.
" She is beautiful, am I as beautiful"
" He is an idiot, I am clever, I think I am anyway, how do I know"
" Thats a nice house, is my house nice"
" where did you go on vacation, I would like to go there"
" that car is better than my car"
3rd Thought. Story telling. Once the mind has completed its measuring and comparing, it tells stories based on the data. We tend to only notice the story telling bit and miss the parts 1 & 2
But if you pay attention during the day, you can catch the mind ceaselessly measuring and comparing prior to the story. It's an exciting game to play with mind, if you can disrupt the measuring and comparing part of the thought process then the mind struggles to make a story. When the story collapses it a great relief.
Also when you catch yourself in full flow of believing a narrative going on in your head, or you catch yourself expressing an opinion, then you can really have a hilarious time of not taking yourself that seriously.
Check it out yourself, see if you can notice the 3 thoughts that the mind is only capable of, and see what happens when awareness becomes witness to this operating system. Persevere it can take a few attempts to see the process in operation..but when you do the matrix crumbles..
I hear you about the AI chatbots. and generally I agree, however I made an Internal Family Systems chatbot and it works brilliantly... for me, at least. As Brian said in your interview, working on your own without a therapist is difficult, but possible.
Having been too ill, and too poor as a result of being ill, for a long time, I developed the skills to more or less 'be my own therapist', simply because I knew I needed one, and couldn't afford one. Add the chatbot to that (having done one IFS session with a human to get the feel of what it's like), and I basically have free therapy whenever I want (even though I healed myself from the illness and now also have more money). I doubt I'm the only one though.
Therapies like IFS, which is a fairly structured protocol during which the therapist basically reminds you of various things to say to your inner parts, is well within the capability of an LLM - IF one also keeps one's brain engaged and discards suggestions which don't make sense, either in the context, or at all. It's like a GPS system which sometimes tells you to go through a red light or drive into a river, but mostly tells you where you want to go.
Yes, that is far from ideal, and major caveats of course apply, but it's probably better for some people for whom therapy is out of reach than not getting any therapy at all. And as LLMs improve, so will their capability to do this sort of thing. I don't believe they will replace human therapists, because of the empathy transfer you point out, but I have found that it is the case that, with practice, one can give oneself the same sort of empathy as a Carl Rogers.
This is not something that anyone in any sort of official capacity would, or should, ever recommend, but then the same goes for psychedelics, and they, for all their strange potential side effects, probably represent a net benefit in the world.
Yeah, I think my attitude towards all this is a bit too flippant. Because I’m not really sure how I feel about AI in general. Although I suspect it’s going to be a pretty negative force in aggregate. Although the idea of bringing it back under the control of the human heart is at least a little bit romantic to me. That said, the idea of an IFS chatbot is mega interesting to me, and I almost want to try it. I think a lot of these modalities can be very effective. And sometimes just having anything that you can speak to is important.
What is the role of nonduality within The Leading Edge? I feel nondual inquiry into the nature of experience has ~always been the true leading edge of inner work that very few humans have ever consciously understood
We have people relatively deep into practice in the group. Personally more focused on nonduality AND duality: the action beyond the realization. Easy to get lost in passive not active.
Sure, the way I mean ‘nonduality’ is inclusive of duality & humanity... yet it profoundly reframes all human activity and allows action to arise from a more organic, spontaneous, artful, intelligent space
Why are rich people sad and spiritual people poor?
When you use the term spiritual people, are you referring to specific spiritual people or do you mean it as a kind of journalistic trope. The spiritual people I know tend to be happier and wealthier than the non spiritual people I know.
The really sad people I know tend to be very poor and without any interest in spirituality at all.
I think when we use the term spirituality it has to be clarified what we actually mean by the word.
A good starting point for me, is that spirituality is the recognition that we are not separate, individual bodies. Spiritual success/development, if that is even such a thing, would be unwavering inner peace regardless of what seems to happen to the body/mind construct. One could be with standing in line to enter a concentration camp and still be absolutely blissfully peaceful inside. Is this the kind of thing you mean when you evoke the word spirituality..?
Excellent article as always! I've never considered starting my own personal network or container - it's something I'll have to explore once I get my financial house in order.
I resonate with your exploration of transformation and the role that community, or “containers,” can play in holding people through challenging growth. There’s a wisdom in your view that community and material support can provide safe, trustworthy environments for individuals seeking profound change. But I find myself drawn to a different approach—one that prioritizes inner sovereignty and believes each of us carries the resources needed for transformation within ourselves.
For me, true transformation starts with creative personal sovereignty. I often ask: What would you do if you were alone on an island? Without community, money, or external support, how would you meet your emotional and spiritual needs? I believe that each of us has an innate capacity to self-nurture, to connect with deeper truths, and to explore our own psyche. Community can certainly be valuable, but in my view, it’s not essential; it’s an addition rather than a foundation.
This perspective makes me wonder how we might create spaces that encourage both community and self-reliance—spaces that acknowledge community support as one path, while also respecting the individual's innate capacity to transform independently. Perhaps community could serve as a gathering place where each person, fully sovereign in their journey, can share their insights freely, without the structure becoming a dependency.
At the core, I think our visions align in wanting transformation that’s both meaningful and sustainable. Yet my approach suggests that while community can hold us, it’s also essential to cultivate an inner strength that can stand alone. I’d be curious to explore how both views might inform a broader framework, one that honors each person’s creative potential, whether rooted in self-reliance or in a more interconnected, shared experience.
Hi Lane, you are spot on in that personal sovereignty is also absolutely key. The paradox, at least from my perspective, is that transformation appears to be a game where no one else can do you push-ups for you, yet it is also extremely difficult to do the work by yourself. A primary goal is absolutely to develop a stronger and more aligned personal/spirtual core. And I am all about self-help. But at least for me, there came a point where I couldn't move forward on my own, and found that finding and commiting to aligned support containers allowed me to develop much faster and with more integrity / safety / trust than I could on my own.
I really appreciate your response—it’s fascinating to see where our perspectives overlap and diverge. You’re right about the paradox: there’s a profound truth in the fact that no one else can do our inner work, yet sometimes the journey can be deeply challenging alone. Your experience with ‘support containers’ as a means to faster, safer, and more integrated growth is compelling and highlights the unique value that aligned community can bring.
It makes me think about how self-reliance and community could each serve as powerful mirrors in the transformation process. While one path is about cultivating inner strength to stand independently, the other is about finding trusted spaces that reflect and expand that strength. Maybe it’s less about choosing one over the other, and more about recognizing when we’re called to walk alone and when it’s time to lean into shared support.
I wonder how we might weave these approaches into a broader framework, where individuals are encouraged to develop their own inner resilience but are equally supported in finding aligned connections. In your view, what would an ideal balance between these two look like in practice? I’d be curious to explore how our insights might inform each other.
I’m glad you brought up the holarchy model! I really like the concept and am aware of Ken Wilber’s work—there’s so much wisdom in how it frames interconnection and evolution. I can see how the nested circles could apply to personal transformation and even the role of community in growth.
That said, I find myself at a bit of a bridge with it when it comes to my own framework on individual creativity. My focus tends to center on the sovereignty of the individual’s inner journey, especially in how we each navigate chaos and creativity as something uniquely our own. But I do think there are ideas within the holarchy that could inform this—particularly around how different layers might interact and build upon one another. It’s definitely something I want to explore further. I'm sure I'm missing something obvious here!
Lane, what if all of your problems arise from the belief that you are something you are not.
You believe you are a separate individual self, what if this belief is fundamentally wrong and is simultaneously a portal of liberation from all or any suffering..
If you sit still for a moment and try to find the individual self, or an ego self or any kind of self, you may find that there is nothing there except thoughts, concepts and beliefs non of which have any abiding substance...
Thank you for this insight—it adds another layer to the conversation on wealth and transformation. I can see the liberating truth in recognizing the self as a construct, where letting go of attachment to a separate identity might free us from a lot of suffering, including struggles tied to material and egoic pursuits.
At the same time, I’m interested in exploring transformation in a way that honors individuality—not as a rigid, separate self, but as a unique expression or channel for creativity. From this perspective, I view wealth and resources less as objects to accumulate and more as tools that can either deepen or distort our connection with our creative essence. For me, personal transformation is about exploring that essence without necessarily dissolving it, but rather, transforming it into something more connected to purpose and meaning.
So after a satisfying skate which was cut short because my son wiped himself out.
Thoughts arise .
Something that people often try to achieve when attempting to mingle spirituality with wealth accumulation is having their cake and eating it.
It's like skating, you can't half commit when dropping into a bowl.
You can't dissolve a bit of the ego and keep a bit.
It's all or nothing. The spiritual market place will tell you otherwise, that spirituality is a kind of app you can bolt onto life to augment the ego construct.
This is a recipe for disaster.
There is only ever one problem in anyone's life regardless of their status.
This one problem will never change in content, though the form is myriad.
The one problem we have covered, the idea that we are something we are not is the root of all suffering.
If one wishes to maximise a unique expression of creative energy in the world, one which is truly incredible, then complete transcendance of the delusional belief of a separate unique individuality is with out doubt the pinnacle of creative expression.
The problem is which spiritual practice is the right practice. That takes sometime.
If you consume to many varieties of spiritual flavours you will get spiritual indigestion.
If you are having a relatively satisfying life, then there is usually no real reason to persue a spiritual path with absolute determination.
It's not until you actually see the futility of maintaining a belief in being a separate self that spiritual practice becomes all consuming. The entire world experience becomes transformed and repurposed towards single goal of awakening from the dream of separation.
Sooner or later everyone comes to this threshold..... everyone.. ✌️
Woo rating! This, methinks, needs an emoji we can "click" next to the heart. Thanks for the insightful work.
Thank you Bradley!
Very interesting and more than one answer depending on where you are observing. Been following you as you are an interesting view on the ways things are playing out 🙏
Thanks Fiona! Think this is just one thread of many. But money is a real thing.
Money is a real thing.
I find myself fairly stunned when I ask people what money is, and they struggle to answer. Even though it seems like a stupid and obvious question.
Even folk who have had a lifetime in financial services don't seem to know what money is.
So here is a great question.
What is money...?
The problem.
If you look at life from a " spiritual " perspective then everything is perfect exactly as it is. From the smallest particle to the largest child labour colbolt mine for must have tech.
If you look at life through the lens of being a separate individual full of desire, personal goals and ambition then the concept of growth and development is important.
If you try to mix the two, you get gobbledygook and mental indigestion.
It's probably healthy to split the two clearly.
Spirituality is the awakening from the illusion of being a separate, unique, and special individual who lives on a special unique planet. This is our only problem, the delusional belief that we are separate individuals.
Money is not a problem, climate change is not a problem, war is not a problem, family history is not a problem, race is not a problem, gender is not a problem, corrupt politicians are not a problem...and so on.
The only problem is the belief we are something we are not.
Everything is perfect - now, everything is working towards awakening from the dream of separation - now.
The one things a separate self hates to hear is that it needs do nothing.
Right where you are reading this, right now, is it.
Complete disinterest in the future, complete disinterest in the past.
Events will arise, plans will unfold, but always here in the present moment, momenting.
Form is emptiness, emptiness is form..
This practical insight may be of use to business people and spiritual seekers alike.
The mind only has three thoughts, which it runs at lightening speed so that it appears as one thought.
1st Thought. Measurement. The mind is always measuring things.
"how old is she"
"how much money does he earn"
"what time is it"
"how much"
"how far is it to the moon"
2nd Thought. Comparison. After measuring things, the mind compares things.
" She is beautiful, am I as beautiful"
" He is an idiot, I am clever, I think I am anyway, how do I know"
" Thats a nice house, is my house nice"
" where did you go on vacation, I would like to go there"
" that car is better than my car"
3rd Thought. Story telling. Once the mind has completed its measuring and comparing, it tells stories based on the data. We tend to only notice the story telling bit and miss the parts 1 & 2
But if you pay attention during the day, you can catch the mind ceaselessly measuring and comparing prior to the story. It's an exciting game to play with mind, if you can disrupt the measuring and comparing part of the thought process then the mind struggles to make a story. When the story collapses it a great relief.
Also when you catch yourself in full flow of believing a narrative going on in your head, or you catch yourself expressing an opinion, then you can really have a hilarious time of not taking yourself that seriously.
Check it out yourself, see if you can notice the 3 thoughts that the mind is only capable of, and see what happens when awareness becomes witness to this operating system. Persevere it can take a few attempts to see the process in operation..but when you do the matrix crumbles..
Great article Tom. You've got a deep awareness here. Thank you for all the great work you are doing in this world.
I hear you about the AI chatbots. and generally I agree, however I made an Internal Family Systems chatbot and it works brilliantly... for me, at least. As Brian said in your interview, working on your own without a therapist is difficult, but possible.
Having been too ill, and too poor as a result of being ill, for a long time, I developed the skills to more or less 'be my own therapist', simply because I knew I needed one, and couldn't afford one. Add the chatbot to that (having done one IFS session with a human to get the feel of what it's like), and I basically have free therapy whenever I want (even though I healed myself from the illness and now also have more money). I doubt I'm the only one though.
Therapies like IFS, which is a fairly structured protocol during which the therapist basically reminds you of various things to say to your inner parts, is well within the capability of an LLM - IF one also keeps one's brain engaged and discards suggestions which don't make sense, either in the context, or at all. It's like a GPS system which sometimes tells you to go through a red light or drive into a river, but mostly tells you where you want to go.
Yes, that is far from ideal, and major caveats of course apply, but it's probably better for some people for whom therapy is out of reach than not getting any therapy at all. And as LLMs improve, so will their capability to do this sort of thing. I don't believe they will replace human therapists, because of the empathy transfer you point out, but I have found that it is the case that, with practice, one can give oneself the same sort of empathy as a Carl Rogers.
This is not something that anyone in any sort of official capacity would, or should, ever recommend, but then the same goes for psychedelics, and they, for all their strange potential side effects, probably represent a net benefit in the world.
Yeah, I think my attitude towards all this is a bit too flippant. Because I’m not really sure how I feel about AI in general. Although I suspect it’s going to be a pretty negative force in aggregate. Although the idea of bringing it back under the control of the human heart is at least a little bit romantic to me. That said, the idea of an IFS chatbot is mega interesting to me, and I almost want to try it. I think a lot of these modalities can be very effective. And sometimes just having anything that you can speak to is important.
Yes agree AI is probably negative overall. Same with social media, although both have brought a lot of benefit to me personally.
Maybe this one is even scarier.
https://youtu.be/YIuw2KuKIoY?si=V_VpRPjexPbVsbY9
Seen as it's Halloween, kind of, and in the spirit of fun and the up coming election.
https://youtu.be/w_RVbD3vqGU?si=CfplcBvcIFytsRxQ
What is the role of nonduality within The Leading Edge? I feel nondual inquiry into the nature of experience has ~always been the true leading edge of inner work that very few humans have ever consciously understood
We have people relatively deep into practice in the group. Personally more focused on nonduality AND duality: the action beyond the realization. Easy to get lost in passive not active.
Sure, the way I mean ‘nonduality’ is inclusive of duality & humanity... yet it profoundly reframes all human activity and allows action to arise from a more organic, spontaneous, artful, intelligent space
another way to point to this:
all doing-ness is downstream of being-ness
humanity can work on its doing-ness all it wants
yet this will not bear fruit if it does not address its being-ness
nonduality addresses being-ness most directly
Jordan, you might like this, there again you might not..
https://youtu.be/ctjW6lZw79Q?si=E2Pa-PA9c-VWLTp2
Thanks for sharing. I can recommend Peter Brown (theopendoorway.org) and Jim Newman for nonduality
Yeah, familiar with that pair.. Jim is a hoot.
For me I always try to keep this idea in mind.
Spirituality has nothing to do with making the world a better place.
🙏
If people are serious about spiritual awakening then I have found these books invaluable. In no particular order.
1. I AM THAT - Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj.
An extraordinary book, both for clarity and compassion.
2. Be As You Are - Sri Ramana Maharishi.
Deep reflection on the nature of Self l.
3.Power of Now - Eckhart Tolle.
A genius work of slipping non duality into the mainstream
4. Awake - Angelo Dilullo.
Demystifies much of the spiritual noise and terminology. Excellent exercises.
5. You Are The Happiness You Seek. - Rupert Spira.
Beautifully written, accessible, illuminating.
6. A Course in Miracles.
This book will take you all the way. Great if you value self-study, and benefit from a structured approach to awakening.
A challenging path for most seekers intailly, but opens into the most exquisite experiences possible, go slow.
Ps ... 0/10 woo rating on these publications.
Why are rich people sad and spiritual people poor?
When you use the term spiritual people, are you referring to specific spiritual people or do you mean it as a kind of journalistic trope. The spiritual people I know tend to be happier and wealthier than the non spiritual people I know.
The really sad people I know tend to be very poor and without any interest in spirituality at all.
I think when we use the term spirituality it has to be clarified what we actually mean by the word.
A good starting point for me, is that spirituality is the recognition that we are not separate, individual bodies. Spiritual success/development, if that is even such a thing, would be unwavering inner peace regardless of what seems to happen to the body/mind construct. One could be with standing in line to enter a concentration camp and still be absolutely blissfully peaceful inside. Is this the kind of thing you mean when you evoke the word spirituality..?
Excellent article as always! I've never considered starting my own personal network or container - it's something I'll have to explore once I get my financial house in order.
Brian,
I resonate with your exploration of transformation and the role that community, or “containers,” can play in holding people through challenging growth. There’s a wisdom in your view that community and material support can provide safe, trustworthy environments for individuals seeking profound change. But I find myself drawn to a different approach—one that prioritizes inner sovereignty and believes each of us carries the resources needed for transformation within ourselves.
For me, true transformation starts with creative personal sovereignty. I often ask: What would you do if you were alone on an island? Without community, money, or external support, how would you meet your emotional and spiritual needs? I believe that each of us has an innate capacity to self-nurture, to connect with deeper truths, and to explore our own psyche. Community can certainly be valuable, but in my view, it’s not essential; it’s an addition rather than a foundation.
This perspective makes me wonder how we might create spaces that encourage both community and self-reliance—spaces that acknowledge community support as one path, while also respecting the individual's innate capacity to transform independently. Perhaps community could serve as a gathering place where each person, fully sovereign in their journey, can share their insights freely, without the structure becoming a dependency.
At the core, I think our visions align in wanting transformation that’s both meaningful and sustainable. Yet my approach suggests that while community can hold us, it’s also essential to cultivate an inner strength that can stand alone. I’d be curious to explore how both views might inform a broader framework, one that honors each person’s creative potential, whether rooted in self-reliance or in a more interconnected, shared experience.
Hi Lane, you are spot on in that personal sovereignty is also absolutely key. The paradox, at least from my perspective, is that transformation appears to be a game where no one else can do you push-ups for you, yet it is also extremely difficult to do the work by yourself. A primary goal is absolutely to develop a stronger and more aligned personal/spirtual core. And I am all about self-help. But at least for me, there came a point where I couldn't move forward on my own, and found that finding and commiting to aligned support containers allowed me to develop much faster and with more integrity / safety / trust than I could on my own.
I really appreciate your response—it’s fascinating to see where our perspectives overlap and diverge. You’re right about the paradox: there’s a profound truth in the fact that no one else can do our inner work, yet sometimes the journey can be deeply challenging alone. Your experience with ‘support containers’ as a means to faster, safer, and more integrated growth is compelling and highlights the unique value that aligned community can bring.
It makes me think about how self-reliance and community could each serve as powerful mirrors in the transformation process. While one path is about cultivating inner strength to stand independently, the other is about finding trusted spaces that reflect and expand that strength. Maybe it’s less about choosing one over the other, and more about recognizing when we’re called to walk alone and when it’s time to lean into shared support.
I wonder how we might weave these approaches into a broader framework, where individuals are encouraged to develop their own inner resilience but are equally supported in finding aligned connections. In your view, what would an ideal balance between these two look like in practice? I’d be curious to explore how our insights might inform each other.
Maybe simplistic but the holarchy model of the nested circles is how I see it: you can’t have one without the previous one.
I’m glad you brought up the holarchy model! I really like the concept and am aware of Ken Wilber’s work—there’s so much wisdom in how it frames interconnection and evolution. I can see how the nested circles could apply to personal transformation and even the role of community in growth.
That said, I find myself at a bit of a bridge with it when it comes to my own framework on individual creativity. My focus tends to center on the sovereignty of the individual’s inner journey, especially in how we each navigate chaos and creativity as something uniquely our own. But I do think there are ideas within the holarchy that could inform this—particularly around how different layers might interact and build upon one another. It’s definitely something I want to explore further. I'm sure I'm missing something obvious here!
Lane, what if all of your problems arise from the belief that you are something you are not.
You believe you are a separate individual self, what if this belief is fundamentally wrong and is simultaneously a portal of liberation from all or any suffering..
If you sit still for a moment and try to find the individual self, or an ego self or any kind of self, you may find that there is nothing there except thoughts, concepts and beliefs non of which have any abiding substance...
No self , no problems..
Peace Richard
Thank you for this insight—it adds another layer to the conversation on wealth and transformation. I can see the liberating truth in recognizing the self as a construct, where letting go of attachment to a separate identity might free us from a lot of suffering, including struggles tied to material and egoic pursuits.
At the same time, I’m interested in exploring transformation in a way that honors individuality—not as a rigid, separate self, but as a unique expression or channel for creativity. From this perspective, I view wealth and resources less as objects to accumulate and more as tools that can either deepen or distort our connection with our creative essence. For me, personal transformation is about exploring that essence without necessarily dissolving it, but rather, transforming it into something more connected to purpose and meaning.
Hey Lane
So after a satisfying skate which was cut short because my son wiped himself out.
Thoughts arise .
Something that people often try to achieve when attempting to mingle spirituality with wealth accumulation is having their cake and eating it.
It's like skating, you can't half commit when dropping into a bowl.
You can't dissolve a bit of the ego and keep a bit.
It's all or nothing. The spiritual market place will tell you otherwise, that spirituality is a kind of app you can bolt onto life to augment the ego construct.
This is a recipe for disaster.
There is only ever one problem in anyone's life regardless of their status.
This one problem will never change in content, though the form is myriad.
The one problem we have covered, the idea that we are something we are not is the root of all suffering.
If one wishes to maximise a unique expression of creative energy in the world, one which is truly incredible, then complete transcendance of the delusional belief of a separate unique individuality is with out doubt the pinnacle of creative expression.
The problem is which spiritual practice is the right practice. That takes sometime.
If you consume to many varieties of spiritual flavours you will get spiritual indigestion.
If you are having a relatively satisfying life, then there is usually no real reason to persue a spiritual path with absolute determination.
It's not until you actually see the futility of maintaining a belief in being a separate self that spiritual practice becomes all consuming. The entire world experience becomes transformed and repurposed towards single goal of awakening from the dream of separation.
Sooner or later everyone comes to this threshold..... everyone.. ✌️
I'm off to the skatepark for the afternoon, a great and recommend flow meditation practice, if you're a youngster like me (56yrs)...
Will think deeply on your reply.. and get back to you 🙏